RODECaster Pro II Main Multitrack:
Well, hey there, Jesse here.

Welcome to another
episode of Science Radio.

Last couple of weeks, we've been
diving into refugee issues and

that's been really enjoyable.

But this week, we have a much more
simple episode, an interview with,

a former R& B legend in New Zealand
and current pastor Kelly Pepper.

Kelly is an Auckland local born and
bred and in the early nineties, he

became famous in New Zealand being
part of one of the very first homegrown

r and b groups in New Zealand.

Music history.

His story is all about the struggles
and triumphs of fame, from growing up in

a small Polynesian community, suddenly
being thrust into the limelight, and

the journey that would eventually see
him becoming a minister of religion,

but I don't want to give too
much away, nor do I want to speak

for him, so let's get into it.

This is Science Radio episode 214,

kelly Pepper.

From purest form to church pulpit

Jesse: Kelly Pepper,
welcome to Science Radio.

It's great to have you.

Keli: Hey, Jesse.

Nah, it's really good
to catch up with you.

Jesse: for those of you who don't
know, Kelly and I are old colleagues.

Well, you know, we're not old, but
we are, that we were colleagues at

some point, uh, brothers and arms
in ministry in North New Zealand.

So it's a wonderful to be able
to reconnect and wonderful to be

able to dig into your testimony.

I remember, uh, Uh, you Kelly sharing,
uh, parts of your testimony here and

there in conversations at pastors
gatherings and all that sort of stuff.

And um, I really wanted to, even back then
see the whole thing, you know, written

down in a book or, you know, on a, on a
podcast interview or something like that.

So I'm really stoked that we can do a
little bit of that today talk more about

your testimony as well as highlight.

the fact that you have written, uh,
very, uh, succinctly, because I'm sure

there's a lot more detail that you
could have covered, an article for us

that's going to appear in the October
issue Signs of the Times magazine.

So I'm really, really keen to get into it.

But before we do that, do you want to
give the fine folks who are listening,

uh, a little bit of an intro?

Who is Kelly?

Um, what sort of was your upbringing
looking like and, uh, what are you

doing with yourself these days?

Keli: hey, thanks Jesse.

It's, um, really good to catch up.

Yeah, I, um, yeah, I stay in Auckland.

I'm, uh, um, Tongan and I've been pretty
much in New Zealand most of my life.

Um, and yeah, so born in Tonga, but
uh, raised up, uh, in New Zealand.

So there's a lot of us , uh,
guys that have just.

You know, brought up in New Zealand,
but we're born in the islands.

Um, yeah, so yeah, got one son,
Tevita, um, married to a beautiful.

Uh, Samoan, uh, lady Anna and, um, yeah,
I've been in ministry for about 10,

11 years now and I'm here enjoying it.

But yeah, I've got, yeah, I love music,
love sport, love hanging out with people,

um, especially young people, uh, just
in a kind of like a role where, uh,

am kind of with the young people a lot
and, um, do a lot of events with them.

Yeah.

So it's really That's
where I'm at at the moment.

Thank you.

Jesse: Wonderful.

Wonderful.

So, you just said that you spent
most of your life in Auckland.

Um, wonderful place.

Uh, you mentioned in your article you grew
up, I believe, in, uh, around Ornahunga.

Is that right?

Keli: Yep.

Yeah, it's a.

Well, it's a beautiful
little suburb in Auckland.

It's not sort of like South Auckland,
but it's kind of like central Auckland.

And it was, I think back in the eighties
was kind of like an industrial sort of

type place, few factories and so forth.

And, um, you know, we were.

In that category of state, we're in the
state houses, sort of, uh, we, we, we

move from state house to state house.

Um, and there was probably
about seven or eight places

that we stayed in in Onehunga.

Um, but Onehunga's, um,
kind of morphed now.

It's got a few wealthy people moving in
and it's quite sort of from middle class

to, people say that Onehunga's like new
Ponsonby, which Ponsonby's like a Like

a flash area in Auckland for those who,
so anyway, um, but Onehunga is like

that now, but before it was quite like
working class families and I was always

brought up in that kind of environment.

Uh, we weren't like, super poor or
struggling or anything like that.

We're kind of like an average type
family, um, uh, from a Christian family.

And we sort of, uh, yeah, yeah.

We just, yeah, just
live from week to week.

And amongst the real strong kind
of Christian culture, Christian

community, that was pretty much my life.

Brought up around music, brought up
around sport, but music was really key.

Jesse: mm,

Keli: and that sort of drew me closer
to sort of, um, you know, meeting

new people and also using what,
yeah, some of my gifts, I guess.

Yeah, so I really went into songwriting.

That was one thing that I really
loved was just songwriting.

So it was around the sort of 90s era.

Um, where, um, there was a lot of
boy bands and groups like that.

And so I got involved with a few guys at
school and yeah, we would want to be boys

to men because boys to men was the group.

And.

I think there were, to be honest, there
were a few other groups in the garages

around South Auckland and they were kind
of like wanting to sort of get on TV.

Um, but we, we've managed to,
I mean, you'll hear it in the

story, you'll see it in the story.

Um, we managed to get the break, which
is kind of like, um, It's, it's huge.

You know, just to be
on TV was a big thing.

And like, I'm talking about early
nineties, this is before obviously

social media and everything else.

Um, so we only had three
channels back in New Zealand.

Um, so like once you got on TV, whether
it's like a simple ad, which was what

we did, um, the whole nation watched it.

Jesse: mm,

Keli: So wherever

Jesse: it was, it was in,
it was in color, right?

I just want to confirm color channels.

Keli: yeah.

So I don't know how you'll be, uh,
Jesse when, man, that would have been It

was in the early nineties, bro.

Jesse: I look, so I think probably
around the time that you were in

high school making music, I was
probably, um, crying in my nappies.

I 92.

So that's, that's, that's how old I

Keli: okay.

Yeah.

So just give you a little bit of a
background on the early nineties.

Cause like, um, yeah, it's just
anything on TV or anything and you

know, that's when tabloids, newspapers
and so forth were So even if you

made the papers, it was big news.

Seriously, and to make it on TV, like
I said, on a simple ad, was huge.

And also, um, like I

said, coming from a working class family.

You would only see, um, perhaps a
certain group of people on, on TV.

Um, but, uh, but yeah, us sort of
teenagers from, uh, from Onehunga

coming on TV was, was huge.

And, um, yeah, it was a
really cool experience.

Jesse: I want to talk a little bit more
about that experience, but I want to

also, because it's interesting to me.

I don't know if it'll be
interesting to anybody else.

So we'll see.

You know, we have a mutual friend,
Pastor Tulanga, who's down in the South

Island, and he was involved a lot in
the music scene in Wellington, which

he, he always told me that was sort
of where R& B and hip hop and lot of

that stuff started in New Zealand.

What was the music scene like in
New Zealand back in those days?

Did it kind of come out of
Wellington and get to Auckland or

was Auckland kind of its own thing?

What was, what was sort
of going on back then?

Keli: Wellington had gifted, talented
people there but I would say the

difference between Auckland and
Wellington, Wellington was more,

Um, how could you say more urban,
more, more traditional, um, they're,

they're more homegrown, more, yeah,
and I would say probably a little bit

more authentic, the, the Aucklanders
were very Americanized, like USA

influenced, just anything American.

Straight from America, um, we will try
to sound like them, we will try to dress

like them, but Wellington were quite,
quite unique, you know, they, they were,

they had a bit of American influence,
but they still wear their traditional

clothes and still be proud to be kind of
Pacific, um, and so, so they, they still

held onto their roots, but us Aucklanders,
we were, a lot of us were plastic, and,

and, um, but there were still some that
were kind of like traditional, but Yeah.

We were really heavily influenced
by a lot of the stuff in the States.

Jesse: Was

there a rivalry?

Were you influenced by each other
or were you just trying to not

be the other kind of people?

Keli: I think probably not, not, not
in the R and B scene, but probably

the hip hop scene where Tulanga
was probably more involved than,

uh, well, not what he hung around.

That was his influence.

He was, you know, he's
into street, street art.

And, um, so probably a little bit of
rivalry in what, in the hip hop scene.

Um, and like, as I mentioned, there
were more kind of real offensive again,

and Aucklanders were more sort of like,
yeah, Americanized, I guess, Tulanga was

one of the reasons why this came about,
to be honest, we had a conversation.

Yeah.

I mean, me and Tulanga are
really good mates and, um, yeah.

And then he suggested, Hey, look,
um, you should write a book.

And I said, write a book,
you know, about your story.

Okay.

And then he was, and then he said,
guess what, you know, we'll hook

you up with, I've got a good mate of
mine, Jared, you know, and maybe get

yourself on an article, you know,
and so that's, this is how it all

started, it was through Te Ranga,

Jesse: You heard it here first, folks.

It's first the article, then
the interview, and coming

soon is Kelly's memoir.

So let's go back to the 90s Um
you are in high school You're

playing with your, with your mates.

So the, the band is called Purist
Form, right So you, uh, making

music together in the garage at
school, all that sort of stuff.

And then you mentioned before
that you got a bit of a break.

You, you kind of got
catapulted a little bit.

How did that all happen?

Keli: yeah.

So we were busking in town and a guy
from, um, Rainbow Zen Entertainment,

he saw us in town busking.

And he was interested, gave us a card,
we contacted him, uh, we started,

um, singing at the, at Rainbow Zen.

And then they asked us to do an ad and
then, um, yeah, that, that was, that

was such, that was our first kind of
break to get on TV and a Rambo's in it.

But that kind of, um, there was a
launching pad towards the next step

was, which was to release a single
and the single was a huge hit for us.

Uh, it was a big buzz.

Um, so because people had seen us on TV.

As the Rambo Zen guys, when we released
the single, they were like, Oh,

Hey, these are the Rambo Zen guys.

And so that really took us to maybe kind
of like top 10 status in terms of singles.

Now everyone, this is the days of
the CDs and um, places like Marbex

and all that stuff like that.

Back in the nineties.

This is ancient growth.

This is like.

Let's just come and go almost
close to floppy, the scary era,

so, and tapes and Walkmans.

So um, but CDs was the, was the thing.

And we were in the, we were run by an
independent label, great management.

We, we were clueless.

We're just like four high school
boys that were involved in, we had

a little management group there.

It was really key because
there was a lot of guys, to be

honest, I'll be very honest.

There were a lot of groups out
there, but they, the only thing

that we had was that group marketed.

And we had managers, and so we had
people that really kind of navigated

us through the whole, um, scene,
which was really, uh, yeah, it was an

interesting experience, um, because
we, we learnt, oh wow, yeah, you have

to have kind of a business mind to
really make it in the music industry.

And so, so there was a combination
of, yeah, obviously a little bit of

talent, but then there was a bit of,
uh, business minds behind it to make it.

successful.

Um, so that's how it kind of,
that's how the journey went.

But this, this single was, was
groundbreaking for a lot of sort

of pop groups or this world kind
of class as the first sort of

boy band group in New Zealand.

Um, um, because

Jesse: So you're kind of breaking,
you're breaking new ground,

like innovative in many ways.

Keli: I mean, on hindsight, it
was like, I'm looking at it and

I'm like, Yeah, it was pretty big,
you know, don't be too like, well,

you know, but it was pretty big.

We, we actually went to like
number two in the, in the charts,

which is, which is quite big.

Um, uh, so yeah, and then we
were up in the, in the area for

about seven to 11 weeks, um, in
the charts and, and we got gold.

I, I, And platinum sort of records.

Um, and now when you're talking
gold, he's talking about 5, 000.

So I don't know in terms of now that will
probably be kind of like just average, but

then we had platinum, which was 15, 000.

So we sold that much CDs country.

Um, uh, but you know, it, was I think
it was a good, I think what I'm hearing

just like now is that, It was a great
encouragement for the groups ahead of

us because just talking to some people
that were like, who I bump into in the

music industry, they just say, Oh man,
Hey, thanks for opening up the door.

And thanks for, you know, um, creating
a, some sort of a legacy or, you know,

to, to, to like, you guys can make
it, we can make it as well, you know?

And so, um, yeah, it was

Jesse: So was it, was it that, was it
that, um, there wasn't much of a music

industry in New Zealand beforehand, or
I don't know if this, you know, correct

me if I'm going out here or was it the
fact that there wasn't much of a music

industry for people of Polynesian descent?

Keli: yeah, I think it was there.

And also, um, genre, uh, genre in itself,
because I think, um, back in those days,

New Zealand was Was pretty much pro rock.

Jesse: Yeah

Keli: that was the genre, whether you were
Polynesian or whether you were, I think

it was just rock was the sort of thing.

And then, um, R& B and hip hop

was kind of sort of like just a side.

It wasn't really the main sort
of, it's a different story now.

Like R& B and

hip hop

is pretty big in New Zealand now.

But back in those days, we were,
yeah, we weren't as big as some

of the rock, um, rock items.

Supergroove was a huge band.

They had Shay, he was Polynesian.

So it wasn't really the
sort of Polynesian thing.

Uh, um, uh, but I'm saying that,
um, a lot of the Polynesian groups

were R& B and hip hop, you know?

And, um, yeah, so some of them, some
of them, uh, went really big after us.

I don't know if you know, um,
you know, OMC, for example.

Jesse: Yep,

Keli: Yeah, they were groups that,
and they, they, he went huge, he

went international and then following
that, you know, the Dawn Raid and

Savage and some of those, they
just did exceptional after that.

Uh, but during, we were kind of like just
in the brink of just a little, a little

opening, the starting point of where
it kind of all came from was when, um

yeah, when we came out.

And maybe just a couple of other groups,
but we, we were number two in amongst

the rock pro rock, you know, and so,
you know, it was really funny because

we're, we felt like just a, we stuck out
like a sore thumb in the musical wards.

And so we sat down and we looked
around and it was, you know, back in

the eighties, it was like that whole.

Sex, drugs and rock and roll type thing,
you know, and, and then here we are, four

kind of church boys, you know, sitting in
the middle of it, and then single of the

year, which was, which was quite unique,
that award, Jesse, because it was not,

um

it wasn't, uh, voted, um, By some
kind of organization, it was,

it was a vote from the public.

Yeah.

So when, when they, um, said that we were
musical, uh, single of the year, yeah,

celebrating it's the public that voted.

Yeah.

Yeah.

So that was affirmation,
kind of affirmation for us.

Um,

Jesse: yeah definitely as, you know,
coming from your background and your

growing up experience, experiencing this
success, what did that do for you and

your fellow band members in terms of your,
the reaction from your community, your

families and the people around you who
saw you grow up, what was that, What was

that like for them to experience that?

Keli: yeah.

It, as I mentioned, just
to make it on TV was huge.

And, um, yeah, mom and
dad were really proud.

In fact, I do remember the first
time they played the Rambozian ad.

They gave us a certain
time, it's gonna be on 11.

55pm on channel 3.

You know, that's what the producer said.

Okay, so watch out.

You know, uh, Wednesday, 11.

55pm and we're all around the world.

The TV screen with our mink blankets
and hot Milo, and it just sitting there

and then, okay, might be able to just
add, and then the ad came on 30 seconds.

And once the ad finished, the whole
family just erupted and just like

cheered and with our celebration.

And so like, you know, it may sound
like this is super cringe and super

weird, but man, honestly, it was, it
was a big thing for us just to, you

know, it's just like somebody who.

He plays for the All Blacks and
then scores a try, you know, and

that's the person that you, that you
know, that's worked hard for that?

At that small little moment,
um, that's, that's what it

kind of felt like, you know, um

and, you know, for family members to
celebrate, uh, success, even if to

others it may seem small, but it was
huge to us in a small town in Onehunga,

um

you know, just, um, just to see, uh, Yeah,
just to see that, Hey, we can make it.

We can, we can, we can actually, um, get
out there and make a name for ourselves

and, and, um, not be sort of hidden
away in our garages and trying to make

music and no one can see it and hear it.

You we weren't hidden anymore.

We were exposed, which
was really massive, man.

It was massive for us to get out there
and just be like, Hey, look, we're here.

Um, we're here.

And I think that's probably, um, what,
what for myself, I think was quite huge.

Was like.

When, when you hear of things that
are small and then they, and then

they make it, you know, that, we were
that kind of story, um, as a group.

We weren't, um,

you know, expected to make big
things, but then we, out of

the blue, big things happened.

Jesse: mm,

Keli: And, um, yeah, so it was, it was
massive celebration around our community

and even people that are new around
the church community and so forth.

Um, yeah.

And it still lingers today, bro.

I mean, I just go around and people
still remember it, which is choice.

I love that.

You know, people still
come up to me and say, Oh,

you know, we remember
that time even to my son.

I mean, we just had father's day.

He just posted up a bit of a, a
little bit of a blast from the

past snippet from our video clip.

So you and he said that
that was pretty cool, man.

Yeah.

That's it.

Yes.

Son.

Yeah.

You just got to go, go hard if you've
got a gift or you've got a talent,

just, just give it heaps, man.

Jesse: mm.

mm.

Two questions.

Um, so the band had a, a life cycle.

you tell me a little bit
about the trajectory?

And then while you're talking about
that, I want you to think about what is

going on in terms of your faith life?

belief in God, um, maybe, you know,
what's happening as you're experiencing

a transition from obscurity to, to fame.

What does that look like
going on inside you?

Keli: yeah we got to a point where,
you know, you get to a certain

age where you make certain really
defining decisions in your life.

And I think that it got to that point
where we didn't look young anymore.

We, we, we didn't look like the
boy band that we used to look like.

And that, and that happened maybe in
a span of maybe three to four years.

Jesse: Oh, wow.

Keli: and, and I'll be very honest.

I think some of us, um, went through
a little bit of, a little bit of

depression in terms of, Trying to
find our way, uh, we were young boys,

just fresh out of school, experiencing
all this popularity and success.

And we just didn't know how to
manage, um, if things fell apart.

We just noticed a decrease in
our sales, we noticed a decrease

in people coming to watch us.

And that was the reality of
sometimes in the music industry, um.

We're just not the in thing anymore.

And then we just realized, um, yeah, yeah.

There were other groups
that were really good too.

And we, we, we, yeah, so we, we
just didn't know how to handle,

I guess, a decline in success
or would you say just failure?

Yeah.

We just didn't know how to manage that.

Um, so we kind of drifted
apart, drifted apart.

It sort of happened naturally.

Um, and we, other
interests came in on board.

And the guys, we sort of made a split.

And so they decided to do their own thing.

And then, um, yeah, some serious sort of
moments in our lives happened for myself.

It was, I was really close to my dad.

It was really a big part
of just my life in general.

And, um, in my faith and he passed
away and I, I didn't, and that

all happened at once like groups
breaking up, dad passing away.

And so then just my whole world
just crashed, you know, and then

I just didn't know where to go.

Um, so I think that was just the beginning
of asking big questions in life, you know,

you know, what's this life all about.

And so I was in the pit for a little
bit, uh, to be honest, Jesse, it was

just a, just the time of my life where.

soul searching, and yeah, I know many,
many people who will be listening have

been through this, and just asking those
really big questions about where to go.

So yeah, um, I did a little bit of a tiki
tour around certain churches, and and I,

I came to a moment where I gave God a try,

yeah, I just gave Him a try, just
fell on my knees and I mentioned in

the article about holding on to the
Bible and like the Bible, I wasn't

very familiar to it to be honest.

It was, it was around home, but
I was still distant from it.

I was from a religious family, but I
didn't have any connection with God for

real, like a real connection with God.

So I saw it, it was
something that was tangible.

I just grabbed it and I held onto it.

Never read it, only heard
key verses like John 3, 16.

And that's all I, you know, just.

You know, big stories like
that, but I was no holy person.

I held onto that Bible and then
prayed and I just said, Oh, I'll

give you a go Lord and whatever
talent and gift I have, just, um, you

know, help me to use it in some way.

So yeah, that was the trajectory.

That was the first starting point
of my faith was, and then I make,

I made steps, uh, towards church.

And then I, I, you know, I, I came to.

A Seventh day Adventist church.

Um, we were Seventh day Adventists,
but I thought I'd give the, uh, We

had a seminar that was happening and
I attended that, and then, um, Yeah,

it was just one thing led to another.

I attended a few, uh, services,
and then I got involved in

evangelism, And then I met Anna.

That's where I met my wife

Yeah,

Jesse: I was gonna ask
about, ask about that.

So Ana came after the, um that experience

Keli: yeah, yeah.

She knew about all that kind of
past experience, but she, she, she

didn't really think much of it.

Jesse: I was gonna say, she
wasn't, she wasn't one of your

Keli: yeah She

Jesse: groupie.

Keli: story man.

She wasn't a at all.

Yeah.

So Anna, Anna came in the picture
and um, and then we developed that

sort of stronger faith together.

Yeah.

Jesse: there's, there's more that
I want to into, but I also, I also

want to give people the opportunity
to read more in, in the article.

So what I want to cover, I think
is what was the, the pathway from,

coming into faith at that, at that,
at that critical moment in your life.

Then meeting Ana, and then deciding I want
to actually spend the rest of my life.

in like ministry, like that's a
huge that's a huge journey, right?

From, from where you were in the music
industry to nowadays, um, if people

don't know you, you travel around
local churches and help, you know,

youth events and, and, and run a lot
of these really, really intense things

to help young people get to know Jesus.

It's a, it's a huge thing
that you're doing now.

So what was that journey of?

Um, you know, coming to a local church
of, of seeing, you know, that, you

know, Jesus was what you needed in
your life to then where you are today.

Keli: yeah, I think it was, it was
something that I've always enjoyed

working in the youth ministry.

In fact, one of the first positions I
came into when I was wanting to get God

back into church was a youth leader.

Um, uh, I think, I don't know,
they just saw some kind of,

um, Of leading the youth.

And I, I love leading the young people.

I think with young people, there's
a freedom of, um, yeah, not, not of

being, of being unconventional , of
being creative, being innovative.

And so that's always been part of my, my
DNA, um, you know, as a, a songwriter.

And, and also creative at myself.

Um, so yeah, I think it was just a
natural thing going into youth ministry.

But I think what got me into ministry,
first of all, was actually, um, when

I, when I was sick, I had leukemia back
in 2006, so that was the game changer.

And um, it was, there was a lot of young
people and a lot of church members that

came and visited me and they prayed for
me, you know, and at that point I didn't

know whether I was fit for ministry.

I didn't know if ministry was my thing,
to be honest, it was like, I thought

ministry was for people who could fit
neckties and, um, and he could, Uh.

who could understand fundamental
beliefs and so forth.

You know, I thought that was for
ministry for, to be honest, I thought

it was really for smart, smart dudes.

And, um, most of them are not smart,
but I thought it was just, um, yeah,

that, that it was, it wasn't for me.

It was just, and so anyway, um,

Yeah, after, uh, being, having leukemia,
that was a, that was a huge thing,

was being sick and then seeing people
pray over me and then going through

sickness, um, leukemia and going into
remission and then seeing other chaplains

pray for people in hospital and one
chaplain coming in and praying for me,

those, those, that was a really pivotal
moment of, Lord, I really like this.

I think this is really, really cool.

I would love to do this kind of service,
go pray for people, pray for people

who are in need, pray for people who
are, who have leukemia themselves.

Um, so yeah, so that was that
kind of changed my trajectory and

I, and I thought that would be
awesome just to go into ministry.

Yeah.

And so, yeah, I, I, there was a lady
who attended a college called Laidlaw

College and, um, she prayed over me.

She was a hospital chaplain.

And to be honest, I asked her, how
do you become a hospital chaplain?

She said, I studied here
and yeah, I held onto that.

So when I came outta hospital, I
think it was maybe a few months

later, I just did a bit of research
on College and I attended it.

Great college interdenominational.

Um, and just met incredible people there.

But it was just the fact that, um,

yeah, that I wanted to pray for
people and who were in need.

Yeah, so that, so I studied Lalo
College, came outta Lalo College

and um, didn't know whether I
was gonna work in local church.

That was a journey itself.

I had anxiety like, Oh probably.

So,

uh, yeah.

we had a few leaders at that time
that tapped shoulders at me and

was working in the local school.

Um, they said, Hey, look, do you
want to be a school chaplain?

Um, for, uh, for the school.

And I said, this is great timing and it
was working with young people, you know?

And so to be honest, most of my ministry
years has been a school chaplain.

So being a primary school chaplain and
high school chaplain and I loved it.

And then they, then they slided
me into the, to the dark side.

no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no,
no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no,

They put me into a local church
was, which was, um, was blessing.

Um, but, um, it had a whole new dynamic.

terms of, uh, dealing with, uh, well,
obviously dealing with older people,

but, um, you know, board meetings,
and, uh, Oh, you know what you see.

You know, the,

Jesse: Oh yeah.

Oh,

Keli: those beautiful, beautiful business
meetings that, that, uh, you know,

Jesse: they just you so, yeah.

Yeah.

They make you soul sing.

know,

Keli: yeah

I know,

Jesse: gotta be careful Kelly.

Otherwise start, uh, we're
spilling all the beans, you know?

Keli: You'll

get me in trouble.

Jesse: Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

Uh, no.

Hey, I, um, I wanted to ask just one
more question, and this is a really,

really practical question, you know.

When I look at young people today, um,
there's, it's a whole different landscape

obviously when, even when I was a kid,
but certainly when you were a kid.

You mentioned, you know, New
Zealand only had three channels on

TV back in Getting on TV was like
the pinnacle of what you could be.

But I imagine, you know, in the world
of social media, today, like that

whole dynamic is, is even more intense.

You could just post a random TikTok
video and suddenly have millions and

millions of people look at your face.

It's, it's crazy.

So what, what would you, what
would you say to the young person

who says, I want to be famous, or
maybe I accidentally became famous?

You know, that it's not that you
have to go through a manager and

you know, a TV station anymore.

Fame is like literally right at
our fingertips if we want it to be.

So what advice would you give to
that young person who either wants

to be famous or is finding themselves
famous on social media or whatever?

Mmm mm

one

Keli: if I were to talk to my
own self, you know, um, at a

younger age, I would just say,
Hey, don't be discouraged because

sometimes we, we compare ourselves.

That's the, one of the worst things is
like, there's so much talent out there

and we want to be like that next thing
We want to sound like the next thing, but

you've got to realize everyone's unique.

And because you don't sound like
Bruno Mars, or you don't sound like a

certain person, it doesn't mean you're
a failure, you just gotta be you.

Seriously, there's only, there's only,
like, I think that's what I would say to

the generational musos that are out there.

Man, just be yourself.

Seriously, you don't have to try to be
somebody else you, if you people, if

you notice most of those artists that
have made a big time, there's only one,

there's only like kind of one Bruno Mars,
there's one sort of Michael Jackson,

there's one, you know, Stevie Wonder.

They all sound, there's no one that sounds
like them, they're their unique self.

And I think to a lot of our
users, we try to compare ourselves

because there's so much out there.

Like you see millions of TikToks and all
that stuff out there and people try to

shape themselves to be somebody else.

And I think that you, you head down
a rabbit hole when you do that,

when you try to kind of conform
to trying to be somebody else.

And I think when you find
yourself and then you, you, I

guess there's liberty in that.

Yeah, you find yourself And you're
like, Oh man, I could just be, I

don't have to try to compare myself.

Then I have to try to achieve to be
like that person or do those trills

or those, or those um, chords or
something like that and just be

yourself and then you'll find yourself.

And once you find that sweet
spot, um, it's, it's, Oh man,

it's probably the best thing.

It's probably the best Like I,
for myself, I haven't, it took me

a while to realize like, man, I
can't do all those really fancy.

Vibrato and those fancy trills and
stuff like that, but I've got a simple

voice, but I've learned to, I've learned
to just accept that and just simple,

like, like, you know, you've got people
who've got really flash voices, uh,

like I said, I mentioned like Stevie
Wonder, but he sounds different to Rod

Stewart, you know, but they're, but
they're both good in their own way.

Um, especially with guys that
are into sort of, um, that really

hugely like we were influenced by.

Boyz II Men for example We
wanted to sound like them.

And, um, it just got to the point
where we're like, we're not,

we're not them We're ourselves.

And I think when you find yourself,
I think that's a cool thing.

Jesse: And can I say, I'm not going
to ask, I'm not going to embarrass

Kelly, but, um, by asking him to sing
on the podcast, but I, as somebody

who has, has heard Kelly sing, he's
kind of putting himself down here,

but he has got a fantastic voice.

And, uh, I did look up
Purist Form on Spotify.

So it's still on Spotify.

You can still listen to some of
this stuff, I think, online, right?

Keli: Yeah.

I think some of our stuff is,
uh, it's on YouTube, Spotify.

Uh, we do have maybe just a little
fan club that's still out there.

It's kind of know, We were on TV on,
uh, one of the New Zealand programs

that was, it was one of the historical
moments that they have on their program.

we're like, wow, thanks a lot guys.

So, so, we featured on that and that
was probably about 10 years ago.

Jesse: are you going to
do a reunion tour anytime

Keli: probably not, but we will get
together and do some kind of, uh,

eating together, I guess, going around
restaurant and just catching up.

But, well, but in terms of, you
know, we, we, we did once upon a

time think of that, but then life
happens, families, commitments, and

everyone's doing their own thing.

Jesse: Fair enough.

Um, final question, and I promise
this is the final question.

Can you be a committed follower of Jesus
and an international superstar musician at

the same time in the world of music today?

Is that, is that possible?

Keli: I would say yes, I hesitated
for a little bit, but I think yes.

Would be the general answer.

Yes.

But it'll be tough.

Yeah.

I'll be, I'll be straight up.

I think, um, yeah, you, you, you can,
um, obviously love Jesus, but I think

it's the, the industry is so diverse,
so competitive, so cutthroat and, and,

um, the business is, you know, sometimes
it can't, it's not a pretty place,

but, uh, but in terms of your relationship
with Christ, yeah, you can still have a

firm one, I think there are artists there.

Also, out there that have
firm, you know, they've got a

firm relationship with Christ.

But you can see that perhaps they're
just, um, yeah, it's not as easy.

You'll have to have a
strong faith, I think.

Jesse: Kelly Pepper, thank
you so much for your time.

Thank you for the article.

I, I really appreciate your, your
friendship and your ministry.

And, um, we just really super
appreciative of your story.

And I, I think that this will be
really helpful for a lot of people.

So thank you.

Keli: Thanks, Jessie.

RODECaster Pro II Main Multitrack-1:
Well, I hope you enjoyed

that conversation with Kelly.

I certainly did.

If you want to read Kelly's
story and anything else, you

can head over to sciencemag.

com.

That's sciencemag.

com.

all of the relevant links
will be in the show notes.

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